Video rendering problem-is it a first?

[edjones]

I post this here following the advice of a forum member although it is not a Mirage problem. I confess that I am completely nonplussed by this as I thought that what I am attempting to do was so basic that I would not encounter a problem at all and if I did there would be simply hundreds (thousands?) of similar examples I could follow to put things right. Wrong. What I want to do is put audio from an MP3 file to a short piece of animation 1280x720 24fps. When I render this in Vegas Movie Studio Platinum8 or Windows Movie Maker the resulting avi or wmv (the most common formats?) the sound is way too slow. If I render to QuickTime it is OK. I have been referred to a couple of video editing sites but, perhaps because they seem more involved with camcorders, I have not as yet found anything that addresses my particular problem. I would be extremely grateful if anyone could help me. If this is any help my sound card is: Sound Blaster X-FI Extreme Audio and the video codec installed is XviD MPEG-4 I'm Running on XP and have 3.25 GB ram. QuickTime seems not to be interested in any of this.

[Paul Fierlinger]

But I used to do the same over and over again from Mirage to Vegas Pro without having any of the problems you describe. I do the same with TVP Pro all the time with no problems. TVP 9.5 Pro now has an EDL with which you can first edit your clips and scenes in TVP and then export the edited sequences to Vegas and not only does all play perfectly in synch, but you never have to change anything in Vegas. So I think it is your choices of NLEs that causes the problem -- both are low-end versions and it now occurs to me that your HD format isn't even supposed to work in those, or am I mistaken?

[edjones]

Thank you for your reply, Mr.Fierlinger. Yes, low-end is my NLE and perhaps also my approach as it never occurred to me that the HD format would not be supported. I will try another format tomorrow and see if that works. Thanks again.

[Paul Fierlinger]

If reducing the format doesn't change anything there are still things to look for in Vegas. I know I have heard this complaint several times before. It has something to do with your audio settings, making sure they match your video setting speeds. Movie Maker I think just has a bad reputation for keeping sound in sync.

[edjones]

I tried the Mirage default: 640X480, progressive, aspect ratio:1, 24fps but still the audio renders slow. I worked through the various Vegas templates for rendering to avi, wmv and QT and only QT works. I noticed in the QT renders QDesign compression is used giving audio good results but the NTSC DV template, uncompressed, slows the sound. Inside my Sounds and Audio Properties I discover that I have audio codec: Microsoft PCM Converter. Somewhere else I noted WMV V9 compression. Well, let's see if a bit of moaning on a couple of video editing forums gets me anywhere.

[slowtiger]

Have a look at your audio sample rate settings. Of course they have to match, otherwise sound would be too slow or too fast, and the pitch too low or too high. I don't know at which point of your workflow the error occurs, but the description strongly suggests this mistake.

[edjones]

Thank you for your interest in my problem, slowtiger. You say my audio sample rate settings have to match. What do they have to match to? If it is the avi I exported from Mirage ( 640X480 24fps.) then how do I do that? The only page that I have found so far, that seems to match my problem is (http://support.soundslides.com/index.ph ... page&id=44). The templates I used to render from Vegas Movie Studio used audio 44,100 Hz 16 bit. I have opened an MP3 file in Audacity checked that it was 44.1Kz 16 bit, exported it as a WAV file, rendered it from Vegas Studio as an avi or wmv and it plays back at a much slower rate. As the same thing happens in Windows Movie Maker does it suggest the problem lies with my computer? Perhaps I need to install a different codec?

[Paul Fierlinger]

What is the Sample rate of your avi codec? Is it the uncompressed Default Template? Most codecs will have Audio Tabs.

[edjones]

I have used the default template in Vegas MS which read: audio 44,100 Hz 16 bit stereo. Most of the templates have this sample which, as I understand it, is the correct one to use. The booklet I got with Vegas is very sparing on the info it gives. For instance all it says about the 'Mixer' is that it gives access to the projects audio properties and output levels. It gives no other info on how these should be set or manipulated to what effect. I do so appreciate all the help I have been offered but am acutely aware of my ignorance and therefore my limited ability to respond to the technical questions I will inevitably be asked.

[slowtiger]

I don't know anything about Vegas, but there should be a project template setting which should include the audio settings as well. It is very likely that this general setting is set to something lower than 44.100.

[Paul Fierlinger]

Well, I don't know what size of video you are putting together, but couldn't you go in the other direction; import the soundtrack from Vegas into Mirage as a wav file and then export the video with the soundtrack from Mirage as an uncompressed avi?

[edjones]

Thank you for your interest in my audio rendering problem, but I have decided, for the time being at least, to let matters rest where they are, for now. The problem seems to be one that, even with your help, Mr. Fierlinger and slowtiger, that I am not able to deal with as I do not have the technical knowledge that sound files and their editing and rendering apparently require. I have fiddled endlessly with various settings and configurations but, whatever I do, with the exception of QuickTime, the sound plays back too slowly. I tried what you suggested, Mr. Fierlinger, and while in Mirage the WAV file plays fine but on rendering, at whatever output settings, the sound is consistently too slow. A couple of times Windows has got huffy about it all and shut down. I have installed Reaper which claims to be professional level audio software. When I try to configure it, it seems my system lacks the ASIO drivers which it prefers for its ideal configuration. Should I download and install these drivers. Will it make a difference? Will I only create problems elsewhere?I don't know. When I select my SoundBlaster X-FI ExtremeAudio card as the default within Reaper, I have imported a WAV file and rendered it numbers of times at various project and audio settings eg. playback resample modes, taking care that they are within the 48.1Kbps, 16bit range, they always play back too slow. So, for the sake of blood-pressure and sanity, and life being too short, I have decided to leave things where they are. For the present. Pixar can sleep securely at nights. Thank you.

[KenC]

This is what I use for Ableton Live and Cubase.

http://www.asio4all.com/

If you soundcard has a dedicated asio driver that's always preferrable but if not asio4all will work just fine, just a little more latancy perhaps which shouldn't be a problem. It shouldn't cause any problems as you need to select it as the asio driver manually so you can allways just go back and turn it off.

Don't know if it will make a difference but it's worth a try.

EDIT: Also, have you tried rendering at 44.1kHz ?

[edjones]

Yes, that was a typo I did there, I meant to put 44.1kHz (see my posts above). Thanks for the info on ASIO, at least I know now that it will not make matters worse. Perhaps I will give it a go.

[edjones]

I installed ASIO4ALL and configured it in Reaper which used Realtek HD. This resulted in Reaper playing no sound from the WAV. file. So the ASIO driver appears not to make any difference, but thank you anyway, KenC.