Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

To talk about anything else

Tablet preferences - Intuos, Cintiq, Tablet PC, or Other ?

Cintiq 21WX
15
36%
Cintiq 12UX
1
2%
Intuos 3
11
26%
Intuos 4
11
26%
Tablet PC or Modbook (Mac)
2
5%
Other (VisTablet, Aiptek, DigiPro, etc.)
2
5%
 
Total votes: 42

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D.T. Nethery
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Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by D.T. Nethery » 21 Feb 2010, 18:43

I regularly get inquiries from students asking about what kind of graphics tablet they should use with TVP. I know this has been discussed before and some of it boils down to individual preferences and drawing styles (just as there is no one "Best" pencil to use which suits everyone, there is no one "Best" tablet solution, but I'm interested in reading other's opinions and experiences) .

I've noticed some comments over the years from some users who greatly prefer using the Intous style of tablet rather than drawing directly on the screen as with a Cintiq , Tablet PC , or Modbook.

My experience to date:
I never really learned to use a Graphire or Intuos tablet very well when I was still mostly doing traditional pencil on paper animation . It always felt awkward to me for my hand to be drawing on a separate surface while looking up at the monitor, and I was not able to acheive the line control that I desired when using a Graphire or Intuos (but in fact I can say that I wasn't very motivated to try that hard because I was still doing most of my work on paper and only used the Intuos for coloring scanned artwork, but not so much for rough animation or clean-up drawings) . Using a Cintiq at work changed my opinion about paperless drawing and I eventually purchased a Cintiq at a greatly reduced price from my former employer when they decided to shut down their in-house production facility and move to an outsource model for production. I've been pretty happy with the Cintiq over the past 3 years. However, the prices of a Cintiq or a Tablet PC/Modbook are still prohibitively high for most students. I don't like recommending equipment or assigning tasks to students that I can't do myself , so recently I have started to apply myself to learning to draw better with the Intuos 3 tablet I own. I am also doing this because it occurs to me that if my Cintiq were to break down I would probably not be able to afford to replace it any time soon on my present teacher's salary. The Intuos tablets are of course much more affordable . The Intuos I own is the the smallest Intuos 3 model, 4" x 6" , which is a handy size for carrying in my laptop case when I'm away from my home studio, but I wonder if this makes any difference to the experience of drawing on the tablet ? Is this a case where size does matter ? Do those of you who favor the Intuos (3 or 4) feel that the larger tablets are a necessity for more precise control over one's line ? What size is recommended ? Is the Intuos 4 really much better than the Intuos 3 or would a student be just as well off to purchase a used Intuos 3 in good condition ?

Even though I have posted a "Poll" at the top to get a general feel for what everyone here is using, I would be interested to read more details about your personal experience with the tablet and why you prefer the tablet you use. From those who prefer the Intuous tablet any tips on getting up to speed using the Intous would be appreciated.

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Sierra Rose
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuous over Cintiq ?

Post by Sierra Rose » 21 Feb 2010, 21:12

I have only used Wacom tablets or paper so my opinion may not be useful.

I find it harder to draw on paper now that I'm used to seeing my work space with no hand at all.

I have been using Wacom tablets for about 8 years (including the little Graphire tablet I started with) and I have to admit that the big size Intuos 4 I now have makes a huge difference over the little size. Also I like the smooth feel over the "traction" you get with a pencil. But then I spend many hours every day drawing so I'm well used to it.
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Byron
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuous over Cintiq ?

Post by Byron » 21 Feb 2010, 21:18

I have an Intuos3 A5. I used to use an A6 tablet, and I can say without hesitation that this is one case where size does matter! If I could afford to, I would upgrade to an A4 tablet - although I would be happy to stay with Intuos3 - I don't see a huge advantage in moving up to the latest model. Not only does the larger tablet give one greater resolution/accuracy - it also allows larger gestures when drawing - encouraging one to draw from the elbow rather than the wrist - which has got to be a good thing for students.

I have never tried a Cintiq - but I would love to. The only thing that concerns me is that, with my Intuos, I attach a sheet of nice drawing paper to the tablet, to give me a nicer, more natural feel when drawing, and obviously this wouldn't be feasible with a Cintiq.

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Paul Fierlinger
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuous over Cintiq ?

Post by Paul Fierlinger » 21 Feb 2010, 22:02

Byron wrote:- it also allows larger gestures when drawing - encouraging one to draw from the elbow rather than the wrist - which has got to be a good thing for students.
I wonder how you arrived at this conclusion. Though I wholeheartedly agree that the larger tablets are far superior to the small ones, I don't think it is an advantage to make use of the tablet's size to draw in large swoops. In my experience this is precisely what slows down the rate of drawings per day when working on paper. I agree that it makes for easier inbetweening but how much of that kind of precision does one come across in the average production?

You differentiate between drawing from the elbow and the wrist; I take into consideration only the two sizes of the tickling of fingers or swoops of the wrist. In my opinion, larger tablets and smaller drawings is the ticket. Speed of drawing is of essence to make a living with animation and the tablet in conjunction with paperless software (in other words, TVPaint) created the largest breakthrough of my career. I tried a Cintiq and it lasted about two weeks before I returned it, never to look back on one again.
Paul
http://www.slocumfilm.com
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Processor: i7-2600 CPU@3.40GHz
AMD FirePro V7900; Intuos4 Wacom tablet

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Byron
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuous over Cintiq ?

Post by Byron » 21 Feb 2010, 23:20

Yeah - I'm very much a beginner when it comes to animation - so I suppose I should have clarified that my comments were more from the perspective of a digital artist, rather than an animator. I do like to draw from the elbow, as I said - I find I can achieve greater accuracy and nicer lines that way, but I'm not able to work quickly.

I would be interested to hear why you didn't get on with the Cintiq - not that I'm in a position to acquire one any time soon, but I'd be interested just the same.

:)

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Paul Fierlinger
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuous over Cintiq ?

Post by Paul Fierlinger » 21 Feb 2010, 23:36

I've covered that question several times around here over the years, but basically I couldn't tolerate that whatever I did, I couldn't make my tip meet the line I was drawing because of the thickness of the glass; I didn't like the glass being so warm under my hand, I didn't like my hand covering most of my view of my characters (I draw small sizes, remember), I didn't like not having my favorite plugins circling the drawing area those and other essential panels and windows were physically too far removed from the space of the cintiq on another monitor, I didn't like the curvature of the glass, I didn't like my hand hanging over the edge of the monitor (I would have to sink it into the table, of course so this drawback would be fixable)... there was more but I can't recall anything else right now. Oh, here's the big one for me (how could I have not remembered to name this first): I couldn't actually see my tip all the time and too well because the pen was so thick and blunt that it covered the view during detail drawing, like drawing with a Zeppelin or a cigar. :roll:
Paul
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AMD FirePro V7900; Intuos4 Wacom tablet

Elodie
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Elodie » 22 Feb 2010, 09:11

I had a graphire A6 and a cheap A4 tablet. Now I'm using an Intuos 3 A5 and my husband a Bamboo A6. I also used Intuos 2 (A5 and A3)) and 4 (A5) in the past and into different animation studios.

I must say my prefere one is Intuos 3 : I'm still using the same lead since 3 years (contrary to the intuos 4's leads that have a shorter life expectancy...), I prefer the gray than black (where you can see better fingers marks... grrr, I hate this !) and I like to have 4 buttons + a slider on each size (and not only on the left...), just because there are short keys you cannot press while drawing (cancel last action, save...).
Bamboo is also really great for people who want to try, without spend 300€. Concerning Bamboo, did you know Wacom wants to stop Bamboo's sales, because they decided to make a Bamboo +, sold for 200€ (I remind Bamboo was sold for 80€...) ? So if you find one in a shop, don't hesitate too long, because they won't be available anymore in a few time ! :roll:

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Peter Wassink
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Peter Wassink » 22 Feb 2010, 10:51

my paperless drawing tools since 1995:
-Amiga mouse good for drawing precise dots, terrible for drawing lines :wink:
-Genius tablet A6 with corded pen (on the Amiga) the cord was not only literately a drag it also wore, causing the connection to break down, oh and no pressure sensitivity! horrible thing.
-Wacom Art tablet A6 (on the Amiga)free pen and finally pressure control! its small size was never a problem on the Amiga with its limited resolution.
-Wacom Intuos A5 Working on the PC, it has the Perfect size for Pal size projects on a single monitor (the tablet is still in good shape but its serial connector makes it unusable on many computers)
-Wacom Intuos 3 A5 Switched to this one for its higher resolution (and USB connection this time)
-Wacom Intuos 4 Large, switched because i could get a good deal and the A5 often felt too small for my 24 inch screen, also the higher pressure sensitivity attracted me, although i don't find i notice a stark difference with the Intuos 3 regarding this, the bigger size is very nice though.
Peter Wassink - 2D animator
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Peter Wassink
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Peter Wassink » 22 Feb 2010, 10:58

Oh and no interest in a cintiq for many of the reasons Paul mentions here.
Peter Wassink - 2D animator
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Fabrice
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Fabrice » 22 Feb 2010, 12:42

I have the TVPaint TabletPC fort he work and an Intuos 3 at home.

People coming from the classical paper animation are always afraid of you when you bring a computer with an Intous Tablet. (What ? You need all that to animate ? I prefer to keep my paper sheet, no need to show me your software ...)
The Tablet PC is perfect to plug on a screen or projector then make demonstrations of the software. It's also very useful to work on new brushes during a trip, in a train, plane, etc ...
In some countries like in Japan or UK, the people wanted to test the drawing directly on the screen tablet, and it was very very useful, I have to admit I can not do without it today.

When I can find time to work own drawings, I prefer not to have my hand on the screen, because it hides panels.
The Intuos 4 has a surface that imitate the feeling of a real paper, however, it shorten the life of the stylus nibs ...
The Intuos 3 has a surface where I can add a sheet of paper if I want, then I can decide how the surface should be (smooth or rough).
My Intuos 3 is in A4 format. I'm fine with this size.
Fabrice Debarge

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Sewie
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Sewie » 22 Feb 2010, 20:14

I work on an Intuos4 XL. I really notice the difference with Intuos3 in pressure sensitivity.
On the large surface I usually do work from the shoulder rather than the wrist and I find that more comfortable.

I've never tried the Cintiq because it never really appealed to me for many of the same reasons mentioned above by other users. Maybe sometime in the future I'll get won over.
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slowtiger
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by slowtiger » 22 Feb 2010, 20:48

I like my Cintiq. I used a tablet for more than 10 years before, but not for real drawing or animating. The Cintiq changed this, and I'm happy with it.
TVP 10.0.18, Mac Pro Quadcore 3 GHz, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11, QT 7.7.3

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Animark
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Animark » 23 Feb 2010, 09:56

I love my Cintiq 21UX. I would never say, that it is like drawing on paper, but for me it works much better than drawing with a Intuos. Like Slowtiger I tried to animate on Intuos for years and it is good for anything except animating.

I had different tablet sizes in the past - from A6 to A4. After some experiences the A6 and A5 worked best for me. The bigger the tablet was the more difficult it was to draw good curves for example. I think this discussion will ending up in a statement, that everyone has to find his personal solution. To know what material is worth to buy you should spend some days of testing. Some minutes in a shop are not enough to find it out.
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Paul Fierlinger
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Paul Fierlinger » 23 Feb 2010, 10:29

Animark wrote:cult it was to draw good curves for example. I think this discussion will ending up in a statement, that everyone has to find his personal solution. To know what material is worth to buy you should spend some days of testing. Some minutes in a shop are not enough to find it out.
I think one must have a strong desire to make it work as well. It took me several days to begin to feel that I can do it; that I can rid myself of the miserable yoke of paper. But I had to be willing to change my drawing style, my drawing techniques; every habit I had associated with the old way I had to push to the back of my mind; learn to hate it, not see the change as giving up something valuable and beloved. Denial can be a powerful tool for transitions.
For me, there were too many advantages I could foresee in the new ways of my world. I was simply motivated to make this big step. The first time you pick up a violin you won't play it well either. The tablet is an instrument, not just a tool, and instruments have to be mastered. We don't realize it but it took us all several years to master the pencil as well.
Paul
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Paul Fierlinger
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Re: Tablet options - Why Intuos over Cintiq ?

Post by Paul Fierlinger » 23 Feb 2010, 10:49

Wow, I just read this article:
http://www.variety.com/article/VR111801 ... =3851&cs=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Elodie posted it on her locked Articles about TVPaint thread. This ties directly into our tablet or cintiq discussion. I am in sync with the people who have the wisdom to not use every computer advantage at their fingertips just because it is right under their noses. Hand crafted work evokes its own excitement in viewers, as the article points out, and overdoing the computer stuff cuts away much of that excitement when overdone. Self restraint should be practiced when mastering paperless animation.
Paul
http://www.slocumfilm.com
Desktop PC Win10-Pro -64 bit OS; 32.0 GB RAM
Processor: i7-2600 CPU@3.40GHz
AMD FirePro V7900; Intuos4 Wacom tablet

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